https://en.orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Western_Rite_Criticism&feed=atom&action=historyWestern Rite Criticism - Revision history2024-03-28T09:19:45ZRevision history for this page on the wikiMediaWiki 1.30.0https://en.orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Western_Rite_Criticism&diff=100184&oldid=prevWsk: link2011-04-25T00:03:02Z<p>link</p>
<table class="diff diff-contentalign-left" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr style="vertical-align: top;" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">Revision as of 00:03, April 25, 2011</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l33" >Line 33:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 33:</td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, the now fairly well-known [[Liturgy of St. James]] once fell out of use throughout most of the Church and has now been revived in many places to be celebrated on [[October 23]].</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, the now fairly well-known [[Liturgy of St. James]] once fell out of use throughout most of the Church and has now been revived in many places to be celebrated on [[October 23]].</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Also special form of Roman Rite Divine Liturgy, the [[Liturgy Of St. Peter the Apostle]] was used with continuity in Holy Mount Athos, and by some Russian [[Old Believers]].</div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Also special form of Roman Rite Divine Liturgy, the [[Liturgy Of St. Peter the Apostle]] was used with continuity in Holy <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">[[</ins>Mount Athos<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">]]</ins>, and by some Russian [[Old Believers]].</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==External links==</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==External links==</div></td></tr>
</table>Wskhttps://en.orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Western_Rite_Criticism&diff=100177&oldid=prevOrthophil: /* Lack of liturgical continuity */2011-04-24T14:01:31Z<p><span dir="auto"><span class="autocomment">Lack of liturgical continuity</span></span></p>
<table class="diff diff-contentalign-left" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr style="vertical-align: top;" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">Revision as of 14:01, April 24, 2011</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l32" >Line 32:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 32:</td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, the now fairly well-known [[Liturgy of St. James]] once fell out of use throughout most of the Church and has now been revived in many places to be celebrated on [[October 23]].</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, the now fairly well-known [[Liturgy of St. James]] once fell out of use throughout most of the Church and has now been revived in many places to be celebrated on [[October 23]].</div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">Also special form of Roman Rite Divine Liturgy, the [[Liturgy Of St. Peter the Apostle]] was used with continuity in Holy Mount Athos, and by some Russian [[Old Believers]].</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==External links==</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==External links==</div></td></tr>
</table>Orthophilhttps://en.orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Western_Rite_Criticism&diff=87731&oldid=prevWsk: links2009-09-22T23:42:58Z<p>links</p>
<table class="diff diff-contentalign-left" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr style="vertical-align: top;" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">Revision as of 23:42, September 22, 2009</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l1" >Line 1:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 1:</td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>{{westernrite}}</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>{{westernrite}}</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>The Western Rite in the Orthodox Church is not without its critics. Objections are made in regards to desire for liturgical uniformity within Orthodoxy and fears that the Western Rite would produce division within the Church. Some question the sincerity of Western Rite converts, just as some question the <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">conversions </del>of those within the Byzantine Rite.  Finally, some complain about a lack of organic liturgical continuity, or will not attend a Western Rite Eucharist.  However, no Orthodox parish may deny the Eucharist to visiting faithful of the canonical Western Rite, regardless of their feelings about the concept of Western Rite Orthodoxy.  There have been no <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">schisms </del>within the episcopacy of the Orthodox Church regarding the issue of Western Rite parishes.</div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>The Western Rite in the Orthodox Church is not without its critics. Objections are made in regards to desire for liturgical uniformity within Orthodoxy and fears that the Western Rite would produce division within the Church. Some question the sincerity of Western Rite converts, just as some question the <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">[[conversion]]s </ins>of those within the Byzantine Rite.  Finally, some complain about a lack of organic liturgical continuity, or will not attend a Western Rite Eucharist.  However, no Orthodox <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">[[</ins>parish<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">]] </ins>may deny the <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">[[</ins>Eucharist<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">]] </ins>to visiting faithful of the canonical Western Rite, regardless of their feelings about the concept of Western Rite Orthodoxy.  There have been no <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">[[schism]]s </ins>within the episcopacy of the Orthodox Church regarding the issue of Western Rite parishes.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==Overview==</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==Overview==</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Whether the Western Rite will grow in its acceptance by Orthodox Christians who follow the Byzantine Rite remains to be seen.  In the meantime, the Orthodox bishops who oversee Western Rite parishes&mdash;and many who oversee no Western Rite parishes&mdash;continue to declare their Western flocks to be true Orthodox Christians and regard them as fully in communion with the rest of the Church.  </div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Whether the Western Rite will grow in its acceptance by Orthodox Christians who follow the <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">[[</ins>Byzantine<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">]] </ins>Rite remains to be seen.  In the meantime, the Orthodox bishops who oversee Western Rite parishes&mdash;and many who oversee no Western Rite parishes&mdash;continue to declare their Western flocks to be true Orthodox Christians and regard them as fully in communion with the rest of the Church.  </div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==Byzantine only==</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>==Byzantine only==</div></td></tr>
</table>Wskhttps://en.orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Western_Rite_Criticism&diff=81991&oldid=prevAristibule: Further use of Western rites.2009-03-22T02:17:53Z<p>Further use of Western rites.</p>
<table class="diff diff-contentalign-left" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr style="vertical-align: top;" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">Revision as of 02:17, March 22, 2009</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l29" >Line 29:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 29:</td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Another response to such criticisms is that the the vast majority of the rites being used by Western Rite Orthodox Christians are not new, but mainly predate the [[Great Schism]]. The ordinary of the [[Liturgy of St. Gregory]], for example, predates the schism. (Many devotions developed after the schism with which critics take issue are in fact paraliturgical.)</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Another response to such criticisms is that the the vast majority of the rites being used by Western Rite Orthodox Christians are not new, but mainly predate the [[Great Schism]]. The ordinary of the [[Liturgy of St. Gregory]], for example, predates the schism. (Many devotions developed after the schism with which critics take issue are in fact paraliturgical.)</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, a number of the pre-schism texts (not simply the ordinary but the propers) have been fully restored and translated, such as the [[Sarum Rite]], a local use of the [[Roman rite]] from the pre-schismatic period[http://books.google.com/books?as_brr=1&id=cyUBAAAAQAAJ&dq=Rouen+Missal&jtp=615#PRA1-PR23,M1]. (The historicity of this claim is disputed by modern Anglican scholars, however.[http://anglicansociety.org/corner/sarum_use.html]) Translations of the Sarum rite are currently utilized in [[ROCOR]] as well as the [[Old Calendarists|Old Calendarist]] [[Holy Synod of Milan|Milan Synod]]. As well, the Ambrosian <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">rite has </del>been used on occasion by the [[Church of Russia|Moscow Patriarchate]].  </div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, a number of the pre-schism texts (not simply the ordinary but the propers) have been fully restored and translated, such as the [[Sarum Rite]], a local use of the [[Roman rite]] from the pre-schismatic period[http://books.google.com/books?as_brr=1&id=cyUBAAAAQAAJ&dq=Rouen+Missal&jtp=615#PRA1-PR23,M1]. (The historicity of this claim is disputed by modern Anglican scholars, however.[http://anglicansociety.org/corner/sarum_use.html]) Translations of the Sarum rite are currently utilized in [[ROCOR]] as well as the [[Old Calendarists|Old Calendarist]] [[Holy Synod of Milan|Milan Synod]]<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">, the latter also having some Mozarabic rite communities</ins>. As well, the <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Celtic and </ins>Ambrosian <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">rites have </ins>been used on occasion by the [[Church of Russia|Moscow Patriarchate]].  </div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, the now fairly well-known [[Liturgy of St. James]] once fell out of use throughout most of the Church and has now been revived in many places to be celebrated on [[October 23]].</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, the now fairly well-known [[Liturgy of St. James]] once fell out of use throughout most of the Church and has now been revived in many places to be celebrated on [[October 23]].</div></td></tr>
</table>Aristibulehttps://en.orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Western_Rite_Criticism&diff=80956&oldid=prevJosephSuaiden: /* Lack of liturgical continuity */ added citations2009-02-16T19:02:05Z<p><span dir="auto"><span class="autocomment">Lack of liturgical continuity: </span> added citations</span></p>
<table class="diff diff-contentalign-left" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr style="vertical-align: top;" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">Revision as of 19:02, February 16, 2009</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l29" >Line 29:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 29:</td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Another response to such criticisms is that the the vast majority of the rites being used by Western Rite Orthodox Christians are not new, but mainly predate the [[Great Schism]]. The ordinary of the [[Liturgy of St. Gregory]], for example, predates the schism. (Many devotions developed after the schism with which critics take issue are in fact paraliturgical.)</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Another response to such criticisms is that the the vast majority of the rites being used by Western Rite Orthodox Christians are not new, but mainly predate the [[Great Schism]]. The ordinary of the [[Liturgy of St. Gregory]], for example, predates the schism. (Many devotions developed after the schism with which critics take issue are in fact paraliturgical.)</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, a number of the pre-schism texts (not simply the ordinary but the propers) have been fully restored and translated, such as the [[Sarum Rite]], a local use of the [[Roman rite]] from the pre-schismatic period. (The historicity of this claim is disputed by modern Anglican scholars, however.) Translations of the Sarum rite are currently utilized in [[ROCOR]] as well as the [[Old Calendarists|Old Calendarist]] [[Holy Synod of Milan|Milan Synod]]. As well, the Ambrosian rite has been used on occasion by the [[Church of Russia|Moscow Patriarchate]].  </div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, a number of the pre-schism texts (not simply the ordinary but the propers) have been fully restored and translated, such as the [[Sarum Rite]], a local use of the [[Roman rite]] from the pre-schismatic period<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">[http://books.google.com/books?as_brr=1&id=cyUBAAAAQAAJ&dq=Rouen+Missal&jtp=615#PRA1-PR23,M1]</ins>. (The historicity of this claim is disputed by modern Anglican scholars, however.<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">[http://anglicansociety.org/corner/sarum_use.html]</ins>) Translations of the Sarum rite are currently utilized in [[ROCOR]] as well as the [[Old Calendarists|Old Calendarist]] [[Holy Synod of Milan|Milan Synod]]. As well, the Ambrosian rite has been used on occasion by the [[Church of Russia|Moscow Patriarchate]].  </div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, the now fairly well-known [[Liturgy of St. James]] once fell out of use throughout most of the Church and has now been revived in many places to be celebrated on [[October 23]].</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, the now fairly well-known [[Liturgy of St. James]] once fell out of use throughout most of the Church and has now been revived in many places to be celebrated on [[October 23]].</div></td></tr>
</table>JosephSuaidenhttps://en.orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Western_Rite_Criticism&diff=80955&oldid=prevJosephSuaiden: corrected text in line with Willibrord's suggestion2009-02-16T18:54:10Z<p>corrected text in line with Willibrord's suggestion</p>
<table class="diff diff-contentalign-left" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr style="vertical-align: top;" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">Revision as of 18:54, February 16, 2009</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l27" >Line 27:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 27:</td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Finally, more historically minded criticisms of the Western Rite usually center around the idea that it is untenable to try to revive a liturgical tradition which was lost centuries ago when the West fell away from the [[Orthodox Church]].  This argument essentially states that, because the Western Rite died out in the Church, and because a continuous living tradition is a necessary element of liturgical practice, the Western Rite ought to be abandoned and only developments from the Byzantine Rite ought to be pursued.</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Finally, more historically minded criticisms of the Western Rite usually center around the idea that it is untenable to try to revive a liturgical tradition which was lost centuries ago when the West fell away from the [[Orthodox Church]].  This argument essentially states that, because the Western Rite died out in the Church, and because a continuous living tradition is a necessary element of liturgical practice, the Western Rite ought to be abandoned and only developments from the Byzantine Rite ought to be pursued.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">In contrast to this claim, others note that it is not a dogmatic principle of the Church that liturgical traditions can neither be revived nor created.  After all, there are whole services even within the Byzantine Rite which are not universally practiced (e.g., the [[molieben]]), so they must have been invented somewhere along the way rather than being part of the [[typikon]] when it first came into the form we now know it. </del>Another response to such criticisms is that the the <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">many </del>of the rites being used by Western Rite Orthodox Christians are not new, but mainly predate the [[Great Schism]].  </div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Another response to such criticisms is that the the <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">vast majority </ins>of the rites being used by Western Rite Orthodox Christians are not new, but mainly predate the [[Great Schism]]. <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">The ordinary of the [[Liturgy of St. Gregory]], for example, predates the schism. (Many devotions developed after the schism with which critics take issue are in fact paraliturgical.)</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Bishop [[Jerome (Shaw) </del>of <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Manhattan]] </del>(<del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">ROCOR</del>) <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">also argues </del>the <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">little-known Liturgy of St. Peter, a </del>[[<del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">liturgy</del>]] <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">outwardly identical to that </del>of the <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Byzantine </del>rite <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">with </del>the <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">ancient Gregorian canon in its place, never fell out of use within Orthodoxy</del>. <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline"> </del>The <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Old Believers and others celebrated </del>this, <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">explicitly endorsing </del>the <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">validity </del>of <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">the Western canon</del>. <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline"> At present</del>, the <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">historicity </del>of <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">this assertion is not universally accepted</del>.</div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Further, a number </ins>of <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">the pre-schism texts </ins>(<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">not simply the ordinary but the propers</ins>) <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">have been fully restored and translated, such as </ins>the [[<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Sarum Rite</ins>]]<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">, a local use </ins>of the <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">[[Roman </ins>rite<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">]] from </ins>the <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">pre-schismatic period</ins>. <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">(</ins>The <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">historicity of </ins>this <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">claim is disputed by modern Anglican scholars</ins>, <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">however.) Translations of the Sarum rite are currently utilized in [[ROCOR]] as well as </ins>the <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">[[Old Calendarists|Old Calendarist]] [[Holy Synod </ins>of <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Milan|Milan Synod]]</ins>. <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">As well</ins>, the <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Ambrosian rite has been used on occasion by the [[Church </ins>of <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Russia|Moscow Patriarchate]]</ins>.  </div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, the now fairly well-known [[Liturgy of St. James]] once fell out of use throughout most of the Church and has now been revived in many places to be celebrated on [[October 23]].</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, the now fairly well-known [[Liturgy of St. James]] once fell out of use throughout most of the Church and has now been revived in many places to be celebrated on [[October 23]].</div></td></tr>
</table>JosephSuaidenhttps://en.orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Western_Rite_Criticism&diff=80952&oldid=prevWillibrord at 18:44, February 16, 20092009-02-16T18:44:33Z<p></p>
<table class="diff diff-contentalign-left" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr style="vertical-align: top;" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">Revision as of 18:44, February 16, 2009</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l27" >Line 27:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 27:</td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Finally, more historically minded criticisms of the Western Rite usually center around the idea that it is untenable to try to revive a liturgical tradition which was lost centuries ago when the West fell away from the [[Orthodox Church]].  This argument essentially states that, because the Western Rite died out in the Church, and because a continuous living tradition is a necessary element of liturgical practice, the Western Rite ought to be abandoned and only developments from the Byzantine Rite ought to be pursued.</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Finally, more historically minded criticisms of the Western Rite usually center around the idea that it is untenable to try to revive a liturgical tradition which was lost centuries ago when the West fell away from the [[Orthodox Church]].  This argument essentially states that, because the Western Rite died out in the Church, and because a continuous living tradition is a necessary element of liturgical practice, the Western Rite ought to be abandoned and only developments from the Byzantine Rite ought to be pursued.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>In contrast to this claim, others note that it is not a dogmatic principle of the Church that liturgical traditions can neither be revived nor created.  After all, there are whole services even within the Byzantine Rite which are not universally practiced (e.g., the [[molieben]]), so they must have been invented somewhere along the way rather than being part of the [[typikon]] when it first came into the form we now know it. <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline"> </del></div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>In contrast to this claim, others note that it is not a dogmatic principle of the Church that liturgical traditions can neither be revived nor created.  After all, there are whole services even within the Byzantine Rite which are not universally practiced (e.g., the [[molieben]]), so they must have been invented somewhere along the way rather than being part of the [[typikon]] when it first came into the form we now know it. Another response to such criticisms is that the the <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">many </ins>of the rites being used by Western Rite Orthodox Christians are not new, but mainly predate the [[Great Schism]].  </div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div> </div></td><td colspan="2"> </td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Another response to such criticisms is that the the <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">vast majority </del>of the rites being used by Western Rite Orthodox Christians are not new, but mainly predate the [[Great Schism<del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">]]. The ordinary of the [[Liturgy of St. Gregory]], for example, predates the schism. (Many devotions developed after the schism with which critics take issue are in fact paraliturgical.)</del></div></td><td colspan="2"> </td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div> </div></td><td colspan="2"> </td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Further, a number of the pre-schism texts (not simply the ordinary but the propers) have been fully restored and translated, such as the [[Sarum Rite]], a local use of the [[Roman rite]] from the pre-schismatic period. Translations of the Sarum rite are currently utilized in [[ROCOR]] as well as the [[Old Calendarists|Old Calendarist]] [[Holy Synod of Milan|Milan Synod]]. As well, the Ambrosian rite has been used on occasion by the [[Church of Russia|Moscow Patriarchate</del>]].  </div></td><td colspan="2"> </td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Bishop [[Jerome (Shaw) of Manhattan]] (ROCOR) also argues the little-known Liturgy of St. Peter, a [[liturgy]] outwardly identical to that of the Byzantine rite with the ancient Gregorian canon in its place, never fell out of use within Orthodoxy.  The Old Believers and others celebrated this, explicitly endorsing the validity of the Western canon.  At present, the historicity of this assertion is not universally accepted.</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Bishop [[Jerome (Shaw) of Manhattan]] (ROCOR) also argues the little-known Liturgy of St. Peter, a [[liturgy]] outwardly identical to that of the Byzantine rite with the ancient Gregorian canon in its place, never fell out of use within Orthodoxy.  The Old Believers and others celebrated this, explicitly endorsing the validity of the Western canon.  At present, the historicity of this assertion is not universally accepted.</div></td></tr>
</table>Willibrordhttps://en.orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Western_Rite_Criticism&diff=80946&oldid=prevJosephSuaiden: Undo revision 80943 -- on what grounds?2009-02-16T18:29:31Z<p>Undo revision 80943 -- on what grounds?</p>
<table class="diff diff-contentalign-left" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr style="vertical-align: top;" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">Revision as of 18:29, February 16, 2009</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l27" >Line 27:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 27:</td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Finally, more historically minded criticisms of the Western Rite usually center around the idea that it is untenable to try to revive a liturgical tradition which was lost centuries ago when the West fell away from the [[Orthodox Church]].  This argument essentially states that, because the Western Rite died out in the Church, and because a continuous living tradition is a necessary element of liturgical practice, the Western Rite ought to be abandoned and only developments from the Byzantine Rite ought to be pursued.</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Finally, more historically minded criticisms of the Western Rite usually center around the idea that it is untenable to try to revive a liturgical tradition which was lost centuries ago when the West fell away from the [[Orthodox Church]].  This argument essentially states that, because the Western Rite died out in the Church, and because a continuous living tradition is a necessary element of liturgical practice, the Western Rite ought to be abandoned and only developments from the Byzantine Rite ought to be pursued.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>In contrast to this claim, others note that it is not a dogmatic principle of the Church that liturgical traditions can neither be revived nor created.  After all, there are whole services even within the Byzantine Rite which are not universally practiced (e.g., the [[molieben]]), so they must have been invented somewhere along the way rather than being part of the [[typikon]] when it first came into the form we now know it.  <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Even then, the rites being used by Western Rite Orthodox Christians are not new, but mainly predate the [[Great Schism]].</del></div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>In contrast to this claim, others note that it is not a dogmatic principle of the Church that liturgical traditions can neither be revived nor created.  After all, there are whole services even within the Byzantine Rite which are not universally practiced (e.g., the [[molieben]]), so they must have been invented somewhere along the way rather than being part of the [[typikon]] when it first came into the form we now know it.   </div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Bishop [[Jerome (Shaw) of Manhattan]] (ROCOR) also argues the little-known Liturgy of St. Peter, a [[liturgy]] identical to that of the Byzantine rite with the ancient Gregorian canon in its place, never fell out of use within Orthodoxy.  The Old Believers and others celebrated this, explicitly endorsing the validity of the Western canon.  At present, the historicity of this assertion is not universally accepted.  </div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Another response to such criticisms is that the the vast majority of the rites being used by Western Rite Orthodox Christians are not new, but mainly predate the [[Great Schism]]. The ordinary of the [[Liturgy of St. Gregory]], for example, predates the schism. (Many devotions developed after the schism with which critics take issue are in fact paraliturgical.)</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div> </div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Further, a number of the pre-schism texts (not simply the ordinary but the propers) have been fully restored and translated, such as the [[Sarum Rite]], a local use of the [[Roman rite]] from the pre-schismatic period. Translations of the Sarum rite are currently utilized in [[ROCOR]] as well as the [[Old Calendarists|Old Calendarist]] [[Holy Synod of Milan|Milan Synod]]. As well, the Ambrosian rite has been used on occasion by the [[Church of Russia|Moscow Patriarchate]]. </ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div> </div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Bishop [[Jerome (Shaw) of Manhattan]] (ROCOR) also argues the little-known Liturgy of St. Peter, a [[liturgy]] <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">outwardly </ins>identical to that of the Byzantine rite with the ancient Gregorian canon in its place, never fell out of use within Orthodoxy.  The Old Believers and others celebrated this, explicitly endorsing the validity of the Western canon.  At present, the historicity of this assertion is not universally accepted.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, the now fairly well-known [[Liturgy of St. James]] once fell out of use throughout most of the Church and has now been revived in many places to be celebrated on [[October 23]].</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, the now fairly well-known [[Liturgy of St. James]] once fell out of use throughout most of the Church and has now been revived in many places to be celebrated on [[October 23]].</div></td></tr>
</table>JosephSuaidenhttps://en.orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Western_Rite_Criticism&diff=80943&oldid=prevWillibrord: Undo revision 80939 by JosephSuaiden (Talk)2009-02-16T18:22:22Z<p>Undo revision 80939 by <a href="/Special:Contributions/JosephSuaiden" title="Special:Contributions/JosephSuaiden">JosephSuaiden</a> (<a href="/User_talk:JosephSuaiden" title="User talk:JosephSuaiden">Talk</a>)</p>
<table class="diff diff-contentalign-left" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr style="vertical-align: top;" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">Revision as of 18:22, February 16, 2009</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l27" >Line 27:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 27:</td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Finally, more historically minded criticisms of the Western Rite usually center around the idea that it is untenable to try to revive a liturgical tradition which was lost centuries ago when the West fell away from the [[Orthodox Church]].  This argument essentially states that, because the Western Rite died out in the Church, and because a continuous living tradition is a necessary element of liturgical practice, the Western Rite ought to be abandoned and only developments from the Byzantine Rite ought to be pursued.</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Finally, more historically minded criticisms of the Western Rite usually center around the idea that it is untenable to try to revive a liturgical tradition which was lost centuries ago when the West fell away from the [[Orthodox Church]].  This argument essentially states that, because the Western Rite died out in the Church, and because a continuous living tradition is a necessary element of liturgical practice, the Western Rite ought to be abandoned and only developments from the Byzantine Rite ought to be pursued.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>In contrast to this claim, others note that it is not a dogmatic principle of the Church that liturgical traditions can neither be revived nor created.  After all, there are whole services even within the Byzantine Rite which are not universally practiced (e.g., the [[molieben]]), so they must have been invented somewhere along the way rather than being part of the [[typikon]] when it first came into the form we now know it.   </div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>In contrast to this claim, others note that it is not a dogmatic principle of the Church that liturgical traditions can neither be revived nor created.  After all, there are whole services even within the Byzantine Rite which are not universally practiced (e.g., the [[molieben]]), so they must have been invented somewhere along the way rather than being part of the [[typikon]] when it first came into the form we now know it.  <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Even then, the rites being used by Western Rite Orthodox Christians are not new, but mainly predate the [[Great Schism]].</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Another response to such criticisms is that the the vast majority of the rites being used by Western Rite Orthodox Christians are not new, but mainly predate the [[Great Schism]]. The ordinary of the [[Liturgy of St. Gregory]], for example, predates the schism. (Many devotions developed after the schism with which critics take issue are in fact paraliturgical.)</del></div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Bishop [[Jerome (Shaw) of Manhattan]] (ROCOR) also argues the little-known Liturgy of St. Peter, a [[liturgy]] identical to that of the Byzantine rite with the ancient Gregorian canon in its place, never fell out of use within Orthodoxy.  The Old Believers and others celebrated this, explicitly endorsing the validity of the Western canon.  At present, the historicity of this assertion is not universally accepted.  </div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div> </div></td><td colspan="2"> </td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Further, a number of the pre-schism texts (not simply the ordinary but the propers) have been fully restored and translated, such as the [[Sarum Rite]], a local use of the [[Roman rite]] from the pre-schismatic period. Translations of the Sarum rite are currently utilized in [[ROCOR]] as well as the [[Old Calendarists|Old Calendarist]] [[Holy Synod of Milan|Milan Synod]]. As well, the Ambrosian rite has been used on occasion by the [[Church of Russia|Moscow Patriarchate]]. </del></div></td><td colspan="2"> </td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div> </div></td><td colspan="2"> </td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Bishop [[Jerome (Shaw) of Manhattan]] (ROCOR) also argues the little-known Liturgy of St. Peter, a [[liturgy]] <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">outwardly </del>identical to that of the Byzantine rite with the ancient Gregorian canon in its place, never fell out of use within Orthodoxy.  The Old Believers and others celebrated this, explicitly endorsing the validity of the Western canon.  At present, the historicity of this assertion is not universally accepted.</div></td><td colspan="2"> </td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, the now fairly well-known [[Liturgy of St. James]] once fell out of use throughout most of the Church and has now been revived in many places to be celebrated on [[October 23]].</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, the now fairly well-known [[Liturgy of St. James]] once fell out of use throughout most of the Church and has now been revived in many places to be celebrated on [[October 23]].</div></td></tr>
</table>Willibrordhttps://en.orthodoxwiki.org/index.php?title=Western_Rite_Criticism&diff=80939&oldid=prevJosephSuaiden: /* Lack of liturgical continuity */ Thanks, Willibrord, for your suggestion!2009-02-16T18:08:26Z<p><span dir="auto"><span class="autocomment">Lack of liturgical continuity: </span> Thanks, Willibrord, for your suggestion!</span></p>
<table class="diff diff-contentalign-left" data-mw="interface">
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<col class="diff-marker" />
<col class="diff-content" />
<tr style="vertical-align: top;" lang="en">
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan="2" style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">Revision as of 18:08, February 16, 2009</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno" id="mw-diff-left-l27" >Line 27:</td>
<td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 27:</td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Finally, more historically minded criticisms of the Western Rite usually center around the idea that it is untenable to try to revive a liturgical tradition which was lost centuries ago when the West fell away from the [[Orthodox Church]].  This argument essentially states that, because the Western Rite died out in the Church, and because a continuous living tradition is a necessary element of liturgical practice, the Western Rite ought to be abandoned and only developments from the Byzantine Rite ought to be pursued.</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Finally, more historically minded criticisms of the Western Rite usually center around the idea that it is untenable to try to revive a liturgical tradition which was lost centuries ago when the West fell away from the [[Orthodox Church]].  This argument essentially states that, because the Western Rite died out in the Church, and because a continuous living tradition is a necessary element of liturgical practice, the Western Rite ought to be abandoned and only developments from the Byzantine Rite ought to be pursued.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>In contrast to this claim, others note that it is not a dogmatic principle of the Church that liturgical traditions can neither be revived nor created.  After all, there are whole services even within the Byzantine Rite which are not universally practiced (e.g., the [[molieben]]), so they must have been invented somewhere along the way rather than being part of the [[typikon]] when it first came into the form we now know it.  <del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Even then, the rites being used by Western Rite Orthodox Christians are not new, but mainly predate the [[Great Schism]].</del></div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>In contrast to this claim, others note that it is not a dogmatic principle of the Church that liturgical traditions can neither be revived nor created.  After all, there are whole services even within the Byzantine Rite which are not universally practiced (e.g., the [[molieben]]), so they must have been invented somewhere along the way rather than being part of the [[typikon]] when it first came into the form we now know it.   </div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Bishop [[Jerome (Shaw) of Manhattan]] (ROCOR) also argues the little-known Liturgy of St. Peter, a [[liturgy]] identical to that of the Byzantine rite with the ancient Gregorian canon in its place, never fell out of use within Orthodoxy.  The Old Believers and others celebrated this, explicitly endorsing the validity of the Western canon.  At present, the historicity of this assertion is not universally accepted.</div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Another response to such criticisms is that the the vast majority of the rites being used by Western Rite Orthodox Christians are not new, but mainly predate the [[Great Schism]]. The ordinary of the [[Liturgy of St. Gregory]], for example, predates the schism. (Many devotions developed after the schism with which critics take issue are in fact paraliturgical.)</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div> </div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">Further, a number of the pre-schism texts (not simply the ordinary but the propers) have been fully restored and translated, such as the [[Sarum Rite]], a local use of the [[Roman rite]] from the pre-schismatic period. Translations of the Sarum rite are currently utilized in [[ROCOR]] as well as the [[Old Calendarists|Old Calendarist]] [[Holy Synod of Milan|Milan Synod]]. As well, the Ambrosian rite has been used on occasion by the [[Church of Russia|Moscow Patriarchate]]. </ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div> </div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Bishop [[Jerome (Shaw) of Manhattan]] (ROCOR) also argues the little-known Liturgy of St. Peter, a [[liturgy]] <ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">outwardly </ins>identical to that of the Byzantine rite with the ancient Gregorian canon in its place, never fell out of use within Orthodoxy.  The Old Believers and others celebrated this, explicitly endorsing the validity of the Western canon.  At present, the historicity of this assertion is not universally accepted.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, the now fairly well-known [[Liturgy of St. James]] once fell out of use throughout most of the Church and has now been revived in many places to be celebrated on [[October 23]].</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Further, the now fairly well-known [[Liturgy of St. James]] once fell out of use throughout most of the Church and has now been revived in many places to be celebrated on [[October 23]].</div></td></tr>
</table>JosephSuaiden