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Talk:Liturgy of St. Tikhon of Moscow
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20:04, August 3, 2008
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http://anglicanhistory.org/alcuin/tract12.html The beginning is an Anglican commentary, and so it starts two paragraphs in. --[[User:JosephSuaiden|JosephSuaiden]] 17:43, August 3, 2008 (UTC)
:Recall we are discussing only whether the requirements of the Liturgy and Hours have been made. The Observations suggest changes, e.g., to Ordination, but all AWRV ordinations to date have been in the Byzantine Rite. Here is the relevant paragraph as to what the committee proposed for St. Tikhon's negotiations: "The committee, after reviewing these 'Observations,' allowed in general the possibility that if Orthodox parishes, composed of former Anglicans, were organized in America, they might be allowed, at their desire, to perform their worship according to the "Book of Common Prayer," but only on condition that '''the following corrections were made''' in the spirit of the Orthodox Church. On the one hand everything must be removed from the Book that bears a clearly non-Orthodox character—the Thirty-nine Articles of the Anglican Confession, the Catechism with its protestant teaching about the sacraments, the Filioque, the idea of the sufficiency of the Holy Scriptures as the sole source of the teaching of the Faith, etc. On the other hand, there must be inserted into the text of the prayers and rites contained in the Book those Orthodox beliefs which it is essentially necessary to profess in Orthodox worship—into the rite of the Liturgy, the profession of belief in the change of the Holy Gifts into the Body and Blood of Christ, and of belief in the sacrificial significance of the Eucharist...Into all the services in general prayers must be inserted addressed [sic] to the Blessed Mother of God, to Angels and Saints, with the glorification and invocation of them (direct), also prayers for the dead (especially in the Liturgy and the Burial Service)." Interestingly, a WRITE ROCOR monk with access to the original has written the Observations were [http://www.monachos.net/forum/showpost.php?p=63041&postcount=102 mistranslated and simply leave their implementation up to the local bishop]!
:As I've noted, the 39 Articles, catechism, and Filioque are gone. The full text of the Orthodox Missal Liturgy of St. Tikhon is not online, but I've quoted enough of it on this page to demonstrate the epiclesis and sacrificial language are present. These have all been made in the AWRV and in ROCOR's English Liturgy. The English Office Noted reflects AWRV Hours, as well. AWRV praxis is to conclude with a Marian antiphon, as well, unless DL follows. Here's the URL: "http://members.cox.net/frnicholas/Matins & Vespers.pdf" (space in original).
:This issue became contentious precisely because certain posters have tried to say these guidelines are not clear, to played semantic games with the wording of the Observations or the authorization of the Orthodox Missal vs. the SASB, ignored prayers contained in both, and expressed their private opinon about whether the changes were "adequate." As Aristibule has noted on various WR pages, there are always the same tiresome attacks when the canonical Western Rite is discussed - another reason a WR Sysop is needed; he/she would save you a lot of headaches. --[[User:Willibrord|Willibrord]] 20:04, August 3, 2008 (UTC)
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